Truthout Original

Greenspan Says, "Who Could Have Known?"

by: Dean Baker, t r u t h o u t | Perspective

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Former Chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank Alan Greenspan during a House Oversight and Government Reform Committee hearing on the financial crisis. (Photo: Reuters)

    That's right, the former Maestro told Congress last week, when asked about the meltdown of the housing bubble and the resulting financial crisis, "we're not smart enough as people. We just cannot see events that far in advance."

    Unfortunately, this sentence is even worse in context. Greenspan told the committee about the brilliant economists on staff at the Federal Reserve Board. His point was that if this group could not see the housing bubble, and the risks it posed to the economy, then it was not humanly possible to see it.

    The reality is that it was possible - in fact, easy - to recognize the housing bubble as early as the summer of 2002. House prices nationwide had substantially outpaced inflation in the years since 1996 (coinciding with the stock bubble) after just tracking the rate of inflation for the prior hundred years. There was nothing in the fundamentals of supply or demand that could explain this run-up.

    Furthermore, there was no corresponding increase in rents. Since people always have the choice to buy or rent, house sale prices and rents should rise and fall together over time, although not necessarily at the exact same pace. In the years since 1996, rents had only modestly outpaced inflation. And they had begun dropping in real terms by 2002. This was not consistent with house prices being driven by fundamentals.

    It was also easy to see that the collapse of the housing bubble would cause enormous damage to the economy. Housing itself accounted for more than 6 percent of GDP at the peak of the boom in 2006. Today, it accounts for just over 3 percent.

    More importantly, housing wealth provided the base for the consumption boom of this period. Research from the Federal Reserve Board and elsewhere shows that annual consumption is increased by 5 to 7 cents for each dollar of housing wealth. This means that the collapse of a bubble that eventually grew to $8 trillion would lead to a reduction in annual consumption on the order of $400 billion to $560 billion (2.6 percent to 3.7 percent of GDP).

    In addition, housing is a highly leveraged asset. In normal times, buyers typically borrow 80 to 90 percent of the purchase price. Of course, housing became much more highly leveraged during the bubble with many borrowers putting zero down.

    The heavy leverage in the housing market meant that it was inconceivable that a collapse of the housing bubble would not lead to serious consequences for the banking industry. I first warned that the collapse of the bubble would imperil the survival of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in September of 2002.

    Greenspan would have been correct if he said that we are not smart enough as human beings to know when the bubble would finally burst. I did not expect the bubble to last as long as it did.

    Of course, I did not bet on there being such a vast reservoir of foolish investors, not only in the United States but also in Asia and Europe, willing to buy garbage mortgages buried in complex derivative instruments. I also didn't imagine the Fed and other regulatory agencies would ever be so completely out-to-lunch in policing mortgage issuance and the practices of the investment banks.

    But the basic story, that there was a housing bubble that would burst, and that it would cause enormous damage to the economy, was completely knowable to any competent economist long ago. The failure of the economists at the Fed, as well as the vast majority of the economists elsewhere, to see the housing bubble and to recognize the damage that would be caused by its collapse, is a testament to the failure of the profession.

    Greenspan's claim that the crisis was not foreseeable is a cover-up for a profession that has badly failed the public. If factory workers or custodians had failed so miserably in their jobs, they would quickly find themselves unemployed.

    Remarkably, in economics, the people responsible for this easily preventable disaster are suffering no negative consequences and, in fact, are still the ones designing the nation's economic policies. Economists believe that if workers are not held accountable for their performance, then they will not do good work. If economists are not held accountable for their performance, then we should not expect good economic policy.

    Contrary to what Greenspan told Congress, "we" are smart enough as people to see asset bubbles like the housing bubble. If his "we" are not smart enough, as he claims, then the current group of economic policymakers must be replaced with people qualified to do the job.

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Dean Baker is the co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research (CEPR). He is the author of "Plunder and Blunder: The Rise and Fall of The Bubble Economy." He also has a blog, "Beat the Press," where he discusses the media's coverage of economic issues. You can find it at the American Prospect's web site.

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How many flippers can dance

How many flippers can dance on the head of a pin before they become a bunch of floppers? Common Sense - always in short supply (lack of demand?) in modern day America.

Greenspan: "Who could have

Greenspan: "Who could have known?" Any dumb schmuck, Greenie!

Check out interviews by Ron

Check out interviews by Ron Paul, Pat Carmack and others at http://drop.io/Summerbird They are free MP3 downloads and cover the economy, politics and other subjects.

A hallmark characteristic of

A hallmark characteristic of the neocons and their supporters is an ability to cling to idealized theory in the face of mounting contrary evidence from reality. "Who could have known" ... that foxes left guarding the hen house would eventually eat the chickens? I mean, isn't it in the foxes' long term self interest to prudently manage the chickens, thus ensuring a bountiful supply of chickens long into the future? Well, it's a nice theory!

Somehow "regulation" is made

Somehow "regulation" is made to look like socialism. What is the most socialist institution in America? The military. Unfortunately humans must be regulated until they evolve enough to move past greed into a consciousness that we are all so connected that it is in our self-interest that all peoples be given the opportunity for justice, peace, jobs and a good life.

"Competent economist"?

"Competent economist"? Years ago, when I was a copy editor on a newspaper business section, I kept telling the section editor and the managing editor there was something very fishy about the savings and loan activity which led to the collapse. They just responded "You don't understand economics." Delusion and immodest expectations rule.

I am a lay person, as far as

I am a lay person, as far as economics is concerned. I attended UCLA as a foreign student starting in June 2002. Within six months, I was being offered teaser rate mortgages. I KNEW it would turn to dust. So, I do not believe Greenspan for a moment. They knew EXACTLY what they were doing, and tried to keep it going as long as possible. This is and has always been a means to transfer wealth from the bottom to the top...

The real culprits are the

The real culprits are the NeoCONS. While they may be arrogant and ham-handed at times, they are not stupid. And who is to say that they don't have their people in the Democratic Party as well? Many of the negative situations we have experienced over the years have been while both Democrats and Republicans have been in power. If you look carefully, you will see that the actions (not the words) of both parties since LBJ are alarmingly similar. We need to look carefully at what the NeoCONS really intend to accomplish. The destruction of the USA as we have known it is merely a side-effect.

its called GREEEEEEEEEEEEED

its called GREEEEEEEEEEEEED Alan! Who could have known, my patookus.... He's basically saying he thought these creeps would be able to overcome their greed.....How faux naive can ya get??

I agree with peterjkrauss.

I agree with peterjkrauss. The Republicans are dumb. They idiotically stood by as Bill Clinton supercharged the CRA in 1995, then stood by as Fannie and Freddie's controls were removed so that ACORN could strong arm banks into giving loans to Democrat constituents they knew could never pay back. They failed to be leaders when in 2005 and 2006, they tried to stop Dodd and Frank's corrupt use of Fannie and Freddie as a Democrat Party money machine, like the 200 grand given to peterjKrauss' Messiah, Barack Obama. They failed as leaders when they tried to stop Fannie and Freddie backing those CRA '95 loans to totalloy unqulified Democrat voters. And, as they watch their lack of leadership fail, the peterjkrauss' of the world are going to give the ones who CAUSED this, by Port Huron Statement design, turn the country into a non-free market Marxist regime. Saul Alinsky's goals are complete: peterjkrauss, et al have fallen for it, blaming it all on capitalism.

Hello all, So, why should

Hello all, So, why should all of humanity be forced to suffer and struggle any longer, now that the entire global financial system has been exposed as a mind-boggling deception, within many other deceptions? No one in their right mind would continue to be enslaved by a proven deception, which is also proven to be undeniable slavery-by-proxy !!! "http://forgingnewparadigms.blogspot.com Here is Wisdom..

I differ with most of the

I differ with most of the respondentsd. Greenie and friends probably did not know, did not have the foresight to be able to know. They, like most Republicans, are not only avaricious, they're plain downright dumb. When you substitute belief for knowledge and build a movement on that, this is what happens. And Greenspan has always been a big believer in Pied Pipers, beginning with his guru Ayn Rand. The problem lies in us voters trusting these people, refusing to tell them they're lying when we finally figure it out and instead giving them one more chance.

Several of you hinted at the

Several of you hinted at the obvious cynicism of this bunch; first they engineer crises (plural) and then they fake surprise while they gobble up the country at bargain prices.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw-Xgpulf64 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Mr4aYcHUOY

Now, if the economists were

Now, if the economists were to learn some mathematics and derive a theory leading to a model of economics, then all of this becomes predictable. This form a scientist who had to learn more advanced math and computer programing to take 28 pieces of information and convert it into a model for designing a particular type of battery. As a scientist I had to learn the math and the programming to make the model. :et yhe economists get off their duffs and learn the advanced math. the programming does not reguire great skills.

"What makes it even worse

"What makes it even worse is that the crazy economy was used to destroy the ecosystems we all depend upon. And while even Ron Paul will not say it, only healing ecosystems is going to end the economic crisis. Vote Green Party Cynthia McKinney for President" EVEN RON PAUL??! ugh ! however cynthia is excellent.

"even Ron

"even Ron Paul"?????????????????? ugh!

How many of you know that

How many of you know that Ayn Rand was his idol and mentor? Now we can understand his actions.

He knew. He didn't expect

He knew. He didn't expect it to falter until the next president got in, so it could be blamed on the Democrats. Of course, Greenspan can't own up to their conservative scheme, but he did say that Bill Clinton was the best Republican president ever. Now why was that? Greenspan as well as DLC Clinton and a vast conservative conspiracy knew and helped in this downfall. The downfall of the economy was thoroughly planned and executed by the conservative EXTREME regime with the assistance of the conservative corporate DLC regime. Our political system should have left all political conservatives on the Right where they actually belong, so as not to be confused with the Democrats, as there is no conservatives actually on the Left, only progressive Liberals on the Left and non-progressive Conservatives on the Right. Too bad.

Well, give a try to do the

Well, give a try to do the research of every eighty year cycle or so. Dig deep and you be the analyst. History is meant to be written by the victor. The end game will one day be played out. Now that is maybe when you need to be the fly on the wall! Interesting times indeed, Watson.

Mr. Greenspan, To repeat

Mr. Greenspan, To repeat what everyone else is saying, it would be easier to tabulate the people who couldn't see it coming than the long list of people who were telling you so at the top of their lungs . If you are actually so deficient intellectually that you were honestly unaware of what was happening, then we have a very strong argument for not giving much responsibility to old people. They just have lost the mental capacity to function even though theydon't give that appearance. The other option is that you knew very well what was going to happen, but can't say so without explaining why you did it which could send you to jail. Looks like Bush is going to have company on the list of worst _____ in the history of the US.

I find it keenly ironic that

I find it keenly ironic that Alan Greenspan, who was a disciple of Ayn Rand, turned out to be precisely the "parasite and second-rater" she railed at in her books. Greenspan and his ilk wasn't one of Rand's supermen; they were more like James Taggart or Ellsworth Tooey, producing nothing of value and expecting a handout. Oh well, who is John Galt?

What makes it even worse is

What makes it even worse is that the crazy economy was used to destroy the ecosystems we all depend upon. And while even Ron Paul will not say it, only healing ecosystems is going to end the economic crisis. Vote Green Party Cynthia McKinney for President

"Who could have known"?

"Who could have known"? When the hedge fund managers, investment bankers, brokers, etc, etc, etc, were all acting like drunken pirates to whom YOU, Mr. Grrenspan, gave the go ahead by not requiring any kind of oversight, YOU should have known. As previous posters have stated, many people were warning about it. Paul Krugman (who just won a Nobel Prize in Economics), Naomi Klein, also Nouriel Roubini, Professor of Economics at NYU, and, of course, anyone with any sense who was not in bed with the financial behemoths. And now we find out that the banks who are being given our tax money in order to "free up credit" are not using it to make loans, but rather to acquire smaller banks. Free market? This is a free market? Privatized profits, socialized risk. That's not a free market. That's pillaging the public treasury for their own profit after they've made stupid mistakes (and, of course, made themselves obscenely wealthy). What a lesson we're teaching them!

What Dr. Baker says is

What Dr. Baker says is consistent with my own experiences. I was doing IT consulting for the mortgage business in 2001, and even then the role of the GSEs in that industry smelled very bad. It was very clear in 2001 that the mortgage origination business was dependent on, and was increasingly abusive of, the faith and credit of the U.S.A., and that the GSEs were involved in a profound conflict of interest: their owners and executives' interest diverged from the interests of the taxpayers who were providing the faith and credit. At the time, the GSEs were more and more openly acting like private entities that just so happened to enjoy the kinds of connections to government that are a hallmark of fascism: the government had picked them as the winners. And again, in 2005, I did IT consulting for a banking regulatory agency that was concerned about the fact that, as a purely practical matter, it couldn't actually parse the derivative instruments that formed a growing portion of the banks' asset inventories, so of course it couldn't mark them to market. Again, there was that miasma of oncoming disaster for the American economy. There was much discussion, but I did not detect any consequential action, and, indeed, the regulators most concerned about the problem were mostly separated from that particular agency, one way or another. The rule of law is a terrible thing to waste, and we must stop wasting it or kiss the republic good-bye.

Why is it that politicians

Why is it that politicians and other members of "the establishment" fail to see the obvious? This is a serious question and one that needs to be researched. My own subject is foreign affairs - it was obvious in 2002 that an invasion of Iraq would have dire consequences worldwide. We Cassandras put together some 7 or 8 major reasons that anyone could have known (see www. dipconsult.eu). But the politicians in both US and UK ignored the obvious. Why? Stupidity - hardly(Cheney, Rumsfeld and the top neo-cons were among the brightest and of course among the most experienced in government). Ideology? Perhaps in part? Gap between ideology & reality? Shere hubris? After watching forseeable and foreseen catastrophe unfolding, at the hands of those "experts" who were supposed to give GW Bush the intenrational/security/military expertise he lacked, I believe a profund enquiry is called for. Why? And now we find the same rejection of the obvious in this history of financial meltdown. For our part, we in foreign affairs warned that obviously one does not go into two wars on a big taxcut and a paltry budget, and that the two wars would require very extensive borrowing which would have dire consequences for the belligerents. The authorities did not listen. But it more astonishing that economists, financial and banking experts, both inside and outside the "money establishment" were ignored despite repeated warnings about negative saving and excessive borrowing - private, government, and business - often involving opaque "products" (derivatives etc.). And almsot everybody knew that the housing boom had to suffer correction - but it went on and on - no correction came which could only mean that when it did it would be all the bigger. YEt no one put on the brakes! Again why? Lemmings? Or just - let the good times roll" Again we need an enquiry into the refusal to see the obvious.

Just like when they lied and

Just like when they lied and told us no one had ever been able to imagine flying planes into skyscrapers. The parallels between the current crisis and 911 are extraordinary. Collapsing buildings: collapsing institutions. Patriot act passed by congress under extraordinary fear and pressure from White House: the 2008 bailout. Think about it. Who benefits?

Greenspan was just repeating

Greenspan was just repeating the GOPathological mantra. Remember how nobody could have ever predicted "terrorists" would use airplanes as missiles? And how no one could have ever predicted the levees would fail? And how no one could have ever predicted we'd need more troops to illegally occupy Iraq, or that Iraqis might not want to be illegally occupied? And who would have ever predicted that robbers would rob banks once they discovered bank robbery was no longer a crime? Heckava job, Greenie - any Medals of Freedom left?

Seems to me there is a much

Seems to me there is a much more basic problem that should have been recognized -- has to do with human nature, i.e., many, many people understand that there are people who cannot be trusted to do the "right" thing when opportunities arise to "steal" money from other people. To ignore those possibilities and do away with the regulations that protect the "sap citizens" is the source of the problem. Mr. Greenspan has demonstrated that he is one who does not understand that aspect of our examples of humanity.

uh ... me. Last fall I took

uh ... me. Last fall I took everything out of mutual funds and put it in a moneymarket option. My 401K provider called me up and talked to me like I was a retarded child. I said, I have no confidence in our leadership in this country; the housing bubble's going to burst; they are beating the Iraq war drum; and China owns us on paper. The stock market is nothing but a casino right now. " ... then I refinanced so that I own one of my two pieces of property free and clear (the one where I grow my food ...). Not gloating, just saying that ANYONE who was paying attention (and I am a business writer, so I read a lot of business news) should have known. As an entertaining PS, the 401K guy held a conference call with all the pissed off and ripped off employees of our company and he really sounded like he had lost his mind. He kept comparing today to events in the 20s and 30s and 70s, as though nothing is different this time, and yammering about "faith" and "confidence" and "hope" He sounded like a street preacher--one a little bit high on meth.

For once I wish that Milton

For once I wish that Milton Friedman was still alive so he could see the damage he's wrought in this country (he was particularly good at ignoring the disasters taking place in foreign countries that followed his advice).

"Who coulda' known?" Well,

"Who coulda' known?" Well, Krugman, Klien, and well, my dachshund. It isn't like we weren't having deja vu from the S & L crisis, all over again. America's premier "economist" was merely a ghost writer for the Brother's Grimm.

Ron Paul seemed to know for

Ron Paul seemed to know for a long time but the media kept playing him off as crazy... well whos crazy now? Wake up and join the campaign for liberty. Lets get our country back on track. www.campaignforliberty.com

Yo, greenpus, you knew it

Yo, greenpus, you knew it was coming. I knew it was coming because no matter where in the country a run down hull of a 4 room house on a piece of land not even twice as big as the house going for $200,000.00 is as obvious as your face is ugly. And you and your 'brilliant' economists at the federal reserve were just not saying anything because you and them knew that that would create a huge financial mess that would benefit the 'elite' that own and manipulate the federal reserve and give you and the 'brilliants' a huge bonus all the while forcing this country to 'borrow' more money from your criminal organization the federal reserve so us the taxpayer would have to pay that money back at your interest rates. You have been trying to talk you way out of any culpability of this mess for a good while now trying to play it as a surprise when it was and is just a grand plan of GRAND LARCENY for you and that useless federal reserve. I would guess that not even now will the congress come to their senses and kick the federal reserve out this country but eventually you and your 'brilliant' lackeys will eventually be booted out and none too soon but hopefully after you and your cabal have serve some well deserved jail time and pay up a bunch of your 'well earned' money in fines for you alls mess.

I remember a year ago, when

I remember a year ago, when they said this thing was contained in the housing market. What came to my mind is that the very last thing a person defaults on his their home mortgage, which suggests that there is a problem with people defaulting on credit cards, cars, etc. etc. If the Fed honestly believed that this problem was contained I would call them far brilliant. I second the motion for a replacement in policymakers.

It should have been

It should have been self-evident that you can't count on the price of anything going up forever. Sooner or later, things will slow down or crumble. The idea of creating "derivatives" out of these subprime mortgages was truly stupid; the fact that people paid good money for them, even more stupid.

The people behind McCain,

The people behind McCain, who co-sponsored with Phil Graham the bill that killed the Glass-Segal Act and allowed investment speculators to become involved in the mortgage industry, knew fully well the opportunity to manipulate an unregulated financial system on a global basis. It these greedy bastards could see it and Greenspan could not, then Greenspan is even less competent than he appeared after the dotcom bubble burst, again to his surprise. Unfortunately every time Greenspan is surprised the economy takes a nose dive and speculators leave behind a damaged economy and destroyed lives.

"Who could have known?"

"Who could have known?" Everyone familiar with the history of capitalist excess in the Gilded Age, and who realized that the 20th century had put regulations in place to prevent such excesses in the future...

Couldn't see it coming? My

Couldn't see it coming? My husband I make a modest living as artists, painting mostly landscapes. We sold our house in 2003 and our stocks shortly thereafter in order to sit out the coming financial tsunami. We tried to warn our friends but they called us "chicken little". We feel no better for their pain but I guess we should have called Greenspan to warn him. Actually, we believe this is a planned piece of what "The Shock Doctrine, Disaster Capitalism" by Naomi Klein describes. They don't hide what they're doing, but you do have to open your eyes.

Who could have foreseen?

Who could have foreseen? I'll tell you who. Ron Paul, for one. He has said it right to your FACE, Mr. Greenspan. And he has said it right to Mr. Bernanke's face. I've seen the congressional hearings on C-SPAN. When he tells you a bubble is building, you just look at him like you know everything in the world, and he's a crazy man. You are smug, dismissive, and arrogant in the face of reason. Yeah, plenty of people saw this coming. Plenty. You just thought you were smarter than everyone else.

In all the writing on

In all the writing on Greenspan's responsibility for this mess, I've never seen anyone point out that he and his Fed cronies finally ended the historically low rates in November 2004 -- right after Bush was safely ensconced on the White House for another eight years. I think this is no coincidence. We all know where Greenspan falls on the ideological spectrum. And his historically low interest rates allowed Bush to crow about record high numbers of home owners, the only claim Bush could make to success on the economic front. Now we know, of course, that this was all a lie, but there's no doubt it enabled Bush to win reelection. We're only now learning the true cost of that victory.

Greenspan smartly enabled

Greenspan smartly enabled his employer to pursue his goals, look good, and maintain legality in doing so. Remember the 'home and ownership society..?' Not everyone was fooled and not everyone partook--what do you have to say to them? But these people were IGNORED at best Might consider hiring us now? .Age does not bring wisdom to everyone. There certainly is no honor among thieves.

Almost everybody knew, if

Almost everybody knew, if they say they didn't, they are lying. I'm no economic expert and with just a little reading, I knew. Our leaders are nothing but BS. They just wanted to keep raking it in for as long as they could, leaving filthy rich, and world economy destroyed. There were many experts warning of this and they will be speaking out shortly. Greenspan is a filthy rich liar!