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Shifting the Burden From Main Street to Wall Street: Why We Need a "Tobin Tax"

by: Ellen Hodgson Brown J.D., t r u t h o u t | Op-Ed

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(Photo Illustration: Troy Page, t r u t h o u t; Adapted From: FrancyFoto, Drifty, ZeroOne / flickr)

"Wall Street owns the country. It is no longer a government of the people, by the people, and for the people, but a government of Wall Street, by Wall Street, and for Wall Street. Our laws are the output of a system which clothes rascals in robes and honesty in rags."

-1890 speech by Populist leader Mary Ellen Lease, thought to be the prototype for Dorothy in The Wizard of Oz

Consider these arresting facts:

  • The Bank for International Settlements estimates that in 2008, annual trading in over-the-counter derivatives amounted to $743 trillion globally - more than ten times the gross domestic product of all the nations of the world combined.
  • Just five super-rich Wall Street banks control 97% of the U.S. derivatives market: JPMorgan Chase & Co., Goldman Sachs Group Inc., Bank of America Corp., Citigroup Inc. and Wells Fargo & Co.
  • Wall Street traders compete to design computer programs that can move many trades in microseconds, allowing them to beat ordinary investors to the "buy" button and to manipulate markets for private gain.
  • Goldman Sachs, the uncontested leader in this game, was reported in September to be sitting on a cool $167 billion in cash. Meanwhile, a September survey of state finances found that state governments faced a collective budget shortfall for fiscal 2010 of $168 billion - nearly the same amount.
  • In 2008, Goldman Sachs paid a paltry 1% in income taxes - less than clerks at WalMart.

Also see:     
Cut Wall Street Out! How States Can Finance Their Own Economic Recovery    •

Wall Street bankers have been called today's "welfare queens," feeding at the public trough to the tune of trillions of dollars. They are taking from the taxpayers and not giving back. These banks were rescued so they could make loans, take deposits, and keep our money safe. But while that is what banks used to do, today the big Wall Street money comes from short-term speculation in currency transactions, commodities, stocks, and derivatives for the banks' own accounts.

Wall Street traders have been criticized for profiting from "speculation" or "gambling," but that criticism hardly goes far enough. With high-speed computer programs, math whizzes, and taxpayers to bail them out when all of that brain power short circuits, these traders are not even gambling. What they have is a sure bet, while the rest of us are gambling, taking real risks for our rewards, which are liable to be few. The winnings of the Wall Street traders are coming right out of our pockets and our tax money.

Meanwhile, the sales tax on these speculative trades is zero. Wall Street's gamblers have managed to trade in practically the only products left on the planet that are not subject to a sales tax. Parents in California are now paying 9% sales tax on their children's school bags and shoes, and race track winnings and other forms of gambling are taxed at up to 25%. But trades in Wall Street's "financial products" get off scot free.

We need to get some of our tax money back, and we can. But first, a closer look at Wall Street's questionable trading practices ....

Why Goldman Always Wins

In the midst of the worst recession since the Great Depression, Goldman Sachs is having a banner year. According to an October 16 article by Colin Barr on CNNMoney.com:

"While Goldman churned out $3 billion in profits in the third quarter, the economy shed 768,000 jobs, and home foreclosures set a new record. More than a million Americans have filed for bankruptcy this year, according to the American Bankruptcy Institute."

Barr writes that Goldman's "eye-popping profit" resulted "as revenue from trading rose fourfold from a year ago."

Why Goldman always seems to win at this game became evident in a revealing incident last summer, in which the bank sued an ex-Goldman computer programmer for stealing its proprietary trading software. Assistant U.S. Attorney Joseph Facciponti was quoted by Bloomberg as saying of the case:

"The bank has raised the possibility that there is a danger that somebody who knew how to use this program could use it to manipulate markets in unfair ways."

The obvious implication was that Goldman has a program that allows it to manipulate markets in unfair ways. Bloomberg went on:

"The proprietary code lets the firm do 'sophisticated, high-speed and high-volume trades on various stock and commodities markets,' prosecutors said in court papers. The trades generate 'many millions of dollars' each year."

Those many millions of dollars are coming from ordinary investors, who are being beaten to the punch by sophisticated computer programs. As one blogger mused:

"Why do we have a financial system? I mean, much of its activity looks an awful lot like gambling, and gambling is not exactly a constructive endeavor. In fact, many people would call gambling destructive, which is why it is generally illegal....

"What makes Goldman Sachs et. al. so evil is that they offer vast wealth to our society's best and brightest in exchange for spending their lives being non-productive. I want our geniuses to be proving theorems and curing cancer and developing fusion reactors, not designing algorithms to flip billions of shares in microseconds."

Gambling is an addiction, and the addicted need help. A tax on the microsecond trades of Wall Street gamblers could sober them up and return them to productive labor, and transform Wall Street from an out-of-control casino back into a place where investors pledge their capital for the development of useful products.

Speeding Tickets to Slow Day Traders: The Tobin Tax Gains Momentum

The fact that speculative trades remain untaxed suggests a tidy way the public could recover some of its bailout money. The idea of taxing speculative trades was first proposed by Nobel Prize winning economist James Tobin in the 1970s; but at the time, the tax raised prohibitive accounting problems. Today, however, modern technology has caught up to the challenge, and proposals for a "Tobin tax" are gaining traction. The proposals are very modest, ranging from .005% to 1% per trade, far less than you would pay for a pair of shoes. For ordinary investors, who buy and sell stock only occasionally, the tax would hardly be felt. But high-speed speculative trades intended to manipulate markets for private gain could be slowed up considerably. Short-term traders, who often make money on very small margins, might be discouraged from trading at all.

Various proposals for a Tobin tax have received renewed media attention in recent months. President Obama gave indirect support for the tax in a Press briefing on July 22, when he recommended that the government consider new fees on financial companies pursuing "far out transactions". Leaders from France, Germany, and the European Commission endorsed putting a speculation tax on the agenda at the G20 meeting in Pittsburgh in September. Brazil has now imposed what may be the first Tobin Tax on foreign investment inflows. A U.S. bill proposing to tax short-term speculation in certain securities, called "Let Wall Street Pay for Wall Street's Bailout Act of 2009", was introduced by Rep. Peter DeFazio (D-OR) last February. A different bill to regulate derivative trades was approved by the Financial Services Committee in October.

Derivatives are essentially bets on whether the value of currencies, commodities, stocks, government bonds or virtually any other product will go up or down. Derivative bets can cause shifts in overall market size reaching $40 trillion in a single day. Just how destabilizing short-term speculation can be - and just how lucrative a tax on it could be - is evident from the mind-boggling size of the market: $743 trillion globally in 2008. Promoters of international development have suggested that a mere .005% tax could raise between $30 billion and $60 billion per year, enough for the G7 countries to double international aid.

More than raising money, however, the tax could be an effective tool for slowing harmful speculative practices. According to a number of Nobel Prize economists, a downsized speculative market would go far towards creating a more sturdy financial system, helping to avoid the need for future bailouts. But if the tax is too small, it might not have the desired effect on speculation. The larger 1% tax originally proposed by James Tobin is therefore favored by some proponents. The much-needed income from a U.S. tax could be split between federal and state governments.

Opponents of the Tobin tax, led by the financial sector, argue that it would kill bank jobs, reduce liquidity, and drive business offshore. Supporters respond that Tobin tax profits could be used to create new jobs, and that the small size of the tax would hardly affect cash flows - although certainly the speculative market would shrink. Players in dice-rolling speculative operations have long claimed that their trades "stabilized" the system by enabling investors to hedge risk, but the recent financial crash has exposed that defense as being without clothes.

Officials from the International Monetary Fund insist that implementing a Tobin tax would be logistically impossible. But Joseph Stiglitz, a Nobel Prize winning economist and former World Bank leader, disagrees. In Istanbul in early October, he said that a Tobin tax was not only necessary but, thanks to modern technology, would be easier to implement than ever before. "The financial sector polluted the global economy with toxic assets," he said, "and now they ought to clean it out."

While Wall Street's welfare queens have been busy collecting generous government handouts, the 50 states have been left to fend for themselves. Some 48 states have faced budget crises in the past year, forcing them to cut libraries, schools, and police forces, and to raise taxes on income and sales. A sales tax on the exotic financial products responsible for precipitating the economic crisis is long overdue.

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Ellen Hodgson Brown J.D. developed her research skills as an attorney practicing civil litigation in Los Angeles. In "Web of Debt," her latest book, she turns those skills to an analysis of the Federal Reserve and "the money trust." She shows how this private cartel has usurped the power to create money from the people themselves, and how we the people can get it back. Her earlier books focused on the pharmaceutical cartel that gets its power from "the money trust." Her eleven books include "Forbidden Medicine, Nature's Pharmacy" (co-authored with Dr. Lynne Walker) and "The Key to Ultimate Health" (co-authored with Dr. Richard Hansen). Her web sites are www.webofdebt.com, www.ellenbrown.com, and www.public-banking.com.

Comments

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Since foxes are all over the

Since foxes are all over the henhouse in D.C., wouldn't the tax just be wasted as well? If the swaps should not be happening in the first place, making money from them puts the government with a vested interest in keeping bad trades going, does it not? The trouble here is not thinking far enough ahead concerning how the already rich have positioned themselves to win because they are so wired in to government duress.

Sounds to me like Obama was

Sounds to me like Obama was either asleep at the wheel or is in bed with the Banking industry. Let's forget Move-on and let's Move-out of the democratic party in the next election. Since Obama has endorsed and supported Chris Dodd, i say let Dodd get elected by the Banking industry and the GOP. The working classes have been doublecrossed big time by the leaders of the Democratic party, Dodd, Lieberman and Obama, and of course Bubba Clinton and Nafta. Ten percent unemployed today.

What a super idea!!! It's

What a super idea!!! It's about time the 'welfare queens' contribute toward their fair share!

Consider these arresting

Consider these arresting facts, so what? 1 Billions of dollars are wagered on football 2 Just 32 teams control 100% of the money made on the sport 3 Football traders watch film and train so they can react and move nanoseconds faster than opponents in order to win games and gain higher salaries. Anyone can put some random facts out there, how does this make your life worse. So Goldman Sachs pays 1% more in tax than they should, everyone that pays an income tax pays more in income tax than they should. Yes plenty of the banks profits is from the fascist policies of the federal government but how does taxing trades to give the government more money help this? It's one thing to hate or be jealous of the rich, but to say that the government should be given more money doesn't help solve that problem

When a bill with an actual

When a bill with an actual political leader's name as sponsor emerges, we can talk about this. Meanwhile the ridiculous profits earned by the financial sector buy all the Congressmen and Senators they can find (which is most of them, and of both parties).

Making posts here are

Making posts here are becoming more difficult as time passes. The problem with humanity is that it ceases to be involved in perpetual conflict. Over time I have gained the knowledge that the few on this globe whom desire control have had this control for quite some time. Seems to me that to keep this control conflicts need to be made, nurtured, and then made to explode. This leads to the need for nation expenditure to either be offensive or defensive. Either way these nation states do not have the appropriate funding, therefore seeking financial help. Oh, the banks. They lend to the victor and the loser. Talk about hedging your bets. Think on that for awhile. Regards.

Yes, tax the trades! The

Yes, tax the trades! The average investor would hardly notice a small charge, and the market manipulators would either have to stop manipulating the market or pay for the privilege.

The good part about this

The good part about this legal theft is more people are becoming aware of it. It is highly unlikely that the highest paid goldman people are nobel laureate material. Exposure will change things. My son, one of the best and the brightest, an economics major, who has been made increasingly aware of these economic thieves, is turning his trading floor into an art gallery. He had an artist, impoverished, taken advantage of my a well known large corporate business, for his talent, who had applied to be a trader, now bunking in his trading floor, and painting large canvases. These traders, who are the best and the brightest, have spent their talents trading money, just to keep up with the enormous cost of living, in which the parameters are set by thieves like goldman, who are controlled by "others" to stay on this neverending wheel of torture to stay even. Bravo to ellen, for her book for her clear explanation of debt created money, for her road map to who owns the government. Her writings need to be collated and taught in high school, college, and grade school economics to reverse the course to disaster these greed mongers have created. Everyone will be happier.

The good part about this

The good part about this legal theft is more people are becoming aware of it. It is highly unlikely that the highest paid goldman people are nobel laureate material. ExpThosure will change things. My son, one of the best and the brightest, an economics major, who has been made increasingly aware of these economic thieves, is turning his trading floor into an art gallery. He had an artist, impoverished, taken advantage of my a well known large corporate business, for his talent, who had applied to be a trader, now bunking in his trading floor, and painting large canvases. These traders, who are the best and the brightest, have spent their talents trading money, just to keep up with the enormous cost of living, in which the parameters are set by thieves like goldman, who are controlled by "others" to stay on this neverending wheel of torture to stay even. Bravo to ellen, for her book for her clear explanation of debt created money, for her road map to who owns the government. Her writings need to be collated and taught in high school, college, and grade school economics to reverse the course to disaster these greed mongers have created. Everyone will be happier.

normally Ms Brown is spot on

normally Ms Brown is spot on on her analysis of the Banksters..but this one isnt.. Tobin was/is a shill for the One Worlders....the Banksters... and to have this inherently global socialist collar on us it would have to be enforced....through INTERNATIONAL monitors on all trades.....The IMF goons are like Brer Rabbit..PLEASE dont monitor trade transactions..PLEASE...that is what they and the globalists want... this of course would strangle financial activities....and put international controls on American traders and investors...and with the impending collapse of the fiat dollar this would be the PNAC-like excuse to get international currency and controls on our backs and into our banks.. this is not one of Ellen's better ones...

The Tobin tax at 1% sounds

The Tobin tax at 1% sounds excellent and should be passed as soon as Congress can do so. While they are at it, Congress should bring back the graduated income tax that we had under Eisenhower. Its lowest tax rung, on the first x dollars, should be pegged to the cost of living. If we returned to Ike's highest rung, which was 91%, recalculated in today's dollars, we would sop up a lot of loose cash that is fueling speculation and the gambling games Wall Street plays.

Wall Street should be taxed

Wall Street should be taxed at least the amount of money it takes to provide strong enforcement against financial fraud, but an enforcement tax shouldn't end there. Taxpayers foot the bill for the armies of FBI agents needed to enforce patent laws for such things as designer handbags and music CDs. That enforcement cost should be borne by the patent holders, not mom and pop taxpayer.

is it necessary to have the

is it necessary to have the J.D. after your name?

One small problem with the

One small problem with the transaction tax. Goldie Sachs and ilk will not pay a dime of this tax. The increased cost of their transactions will be passed onto us through higher fees or lower returns on our investments. And let these behemoths fail. No more bail-outs. No funds or insurance waiting to prop them up. This will only encourage more risk taking. Enough.

If you think that

If you think that organizations that control $740 trillion and admit to 1os of billions in profits because they cannot hide them fast enough will willing give up this kind of money without pouring it into Congress's coffers you have not walked long enough on this earth. The last time Congress whispered of increasing capital taxes no less than Harry Reid was prompted by a fraction of a fraction of that cash to table the entire bill. Don't hold your breath.

My main purpose in writing

My main purpose in writing this article was to expose the outrageous trading practices of Goldman et al. The whole stock market is actually gambling and is not nearly so critical to the economy as everybody thinks. It's good for gamblers (or not, depending on if they win or lose), but it doesn't actually fund businesses. The only money going to the business is at the IPO (initial public offering), which is not traded on the stock market. Stock market trades are all secondary trades -- buying from other buyers, hoping to find a sucker who will buy at an even higher price. I'm in the stock market myself, and I like gambling; but I don't like the fact that the big boys can manipulate markets unfairly with their program trading. They need to be stopped, and a Tobin tax seems as likely as anything to do it. Since they own Congress, however, I doubt the tax would actually pass; my current goal is chiefly to inform and expose.

On a Tobin tax discouraging

On a Tobin tax discouraging investment, I disagree. It would merely discourage speculative high-speed trading. When I used to have my money with a broker and paid $100 per trade, I pursued a buy and hold strategy, investing only in companies I thought were good productive long-term investments. When I switched to Scottrade at $7/trade, I did a lot more trading; but I didn't have any more money in the stock market than when I was with a regular broker. I just played the market more. A modest tax on trades will not discourage prudent investors looking to own companies with good productive potential. But it will discourage program traders doing multiple trades per second. "Hot money" inflows are not really good for a country. They create quick speculative bubbles that can collapse equally quickly when the hot money flows out again. Better the prudent, reasoned investments that intend to stick around a while.

One more comment: the Tobin

One more comment: the Tobin tax is being co-opted by the G20 and the Bank for International Settlements, which are talking about imposing it globally. If we want to make sure that money gets used in the U.S. for U.S. recovery purposes, we need to agitate to have it adopted in the U.S. on our terms, to be used for U.S. purposes, with the proceeds split with state governments for local use. If we stand aloof and say nothing, we will wind up paying a tax to the globalists for purposes adverse to our national interests.

The primary point of the

The primary point of the Tobin tax is not to rake money in, though that is clearly a nice side effect. The point is to ensure that investors don't snap out of a market on a whim, that the finances of actual productive economy would be a little more stable so that you and I and all the other productive people (those of us all that actually generate wealth as opposed to raking in riches that we don't produce) can have a more stable job and keep on producing riches. I think the problem in the public discourse is that all the hullabaloo about market being efficient is true to some extent when it applies to the productive economy - but this financial capitalism is ruining it all: some companies now close plants when their ROE is "just" 9% while the financial markets request at least 13 to 15% - what does this mean? It means that good, productive workers who are actually generating money get a pink slip for not being "efficient" enough. If the cost of flowing the money out was 1% per transaction, these workers would still have a job, be able to pay their mortgages and so on. In addition, the tax has the nice side-effect of generating enough cash for useful governemtn programs (health care, anyone?). It is time that the public discourse correctly identifies Wall St. gambling for what it is: gamblers who make mony on the back of the productive economy risking it all; and the banksters for the parasites they are, claiming a hugely bigger share of the world riches than what the service they are actually providing to the productive economy (yes, there is) is worth.

if anyone can find a law

if anyone can find a law that captivates the attention of the gambling in Vegas...why not Wall Street. Sure the big boys still dont pay..they never will..that is not the game..but at least build in some controls and some taxes that find its way back to the peoples purse, instead of NONE. I live in Philippines. We have a small tax on all stock transactions with the proceeds going directly into the President and her family personal funds. And of course they all steal from each other, all the way up the ladder..but at least it keeps them busy counting there stolen money..while the rest of the nation is able to get a bowl of rice without the President taking time to notice...the people win..as they get something to eat...while the Garbage heap that call themselves Politians are busy sucking up a controlled amount of Billions and Billions. If you are seeking people who feel SHAME..you have come to the wrong planet...the bankers, wall street, will kill all the people on earth with there personal greed...that is why i imagine the National Moto of Philippines is " moderate your greed'...deeply religious, deeply Catholic, the nation was built on the principals of greed and crimes against humanity...it's there nature..yes? Like the scorpion...it may WANT to give you a SAFE LIFT...but...it will sting and kill you even at the cost of its own life...IT's there nature.

The solution for the left is

The solution for the left is not to turn the government over to the Palinites, which would be the effect of voting the Obamanoids out of office. but rather to build a grass-roots, militant socialist movement capable of exerting pressure on the power centers.

This is what won the New Deal concessions back in Roosevelt's day.

It worked then, and would work again. But these things don't grow spontaneously out of ragpiles. They take a lot of deliberate effort and entail big personal risks to the organizers.

Great quote from Populist

Great quote from Populist Mary Ellen Lease In my own studies, I noted recently the govt has twice "saved the top of the food chain" at the expense of The Forgotten Man. Of course, the most reason episode was the expropriation of taxpayer dollars to bail out wall st in 2008-09. This exprorpriation and transfer of wealth has allowed Wall Street to award record bonuses in 2009. The rage is palpable. The last time the rage was this palpable was back in April 1933 was when FDR implemented his Gold Confiscation Act. Banks were insolvent and the Forgotten Man was chided by FDR for hoarding gold, not doing his part to help insolvent banks. Once the gold was confiscated, and US gold reserves shot up to recap the banking system, the Forgotten Man's purchasing power of the dollars he was left holding was devalued 40%, and oh, that gold now in the US banking system shot up 40%. This was another form of expropriation to save the banking system at the expense of the Forgotten Man. It was the 1933 banking crisis that gave rise to this unconstitutional confiscation. Seems a finanical crisis is always used as a justification to throw the constitution to the dogs. The confiscation was challenged in the US Supreme court, and incensed more than one Sup court Justice - just don't have the quote handy

Yes, Ellen, The proposal

Yes, Ellen, The proposal of a 0.5% tax would be too small to disincentivize anybody from a sure bet. Don't forget the exchanges also give these HFT systems free commisions for being SLP's or suppleemental liquidity providers. SLP's is a misnomer, they do not provide any needed liquidity when liquidity is needed. They are pro-cyclical and when a crisis arrives, the SLPs do not have to make a market. So, SLPs are fraudulent, and the exchanges are in bed with them making this possible. So, you only got part of the picture here Ellen. There is more devil in the details.

Ellen, One final point,

Ellen, One final point, the HFT and algo systems exploiting trades on exchange traded products is not a speculative practice, it is a middleman transaction, or a sure bet as you put it earlier. Where the speculative and harmful practices are occurring are on the the OTC debt and derivatives markets that do not trade on exchanges. And this you I presume already know. So, if you really want to get at the heart of the problem, the focus must be on shrinking the OTC markets, shrink the weapons of mass destruction and we shrink the systemic risks that result from all this tight coupling and interconnectedness between counterparties.

Every single one of these

Every single one of these complains and suggestions/demands amount to less than even bandaids for a heart attack. In every case you are all leaving in place the system, and it's controllers - capitalism and the capitalists. Much better reforms have been put in place by the blood (literally), sweat, and hard work of thousands over the life of this country and every one left the very same powers in place (with rare small instances-which were almost immeadiately overcome by power of the system of oligarchic "owners)-with no lasting effects. They only made the system stronger as it learned to take on ever greater powers to control entire governments and law-making. It IS the SYSTEM, I think many of you inherently realize this, and unless WE actively rid ourselves of IT, there can be no relief. This DOES call for revolution, an extremely difficult one, with constant diligence forever after. It is clear that few understand the nature of "socialism". Socialism is NOT "government" control, as constantly described by distracters, to the contrary, socialism is government BY the workers (who is not a worker?) with full representation and immeadiate recall for miss-representation.

To John L.Opperman - indeed

To John L.Opperman - indeed what is proposed here is more reform than revolution, but at this point in the game we (rich people of the first world) have a lot more to lose at revolution than at reform. What I tried to point out earlier (Sun, 11/08/2009 - 23:49) was that we all tend to mix up two sorts of capitalists. The first one are the industrial capitalists who invest in productive tools and projects, who do generate riches and who do -truth be said- profit of every bump in the road to increase downard pressure on the wages of those (like you or me) who actually do the job. The other sort includes the Goldman Sachs of the world, moving money at light speed from one company to another, requiring ever and ever higher ROE and condemning to cash suffocation the ones they skip. I can live with the first type: they have a face and we can go and argue with them for we are on both sides of the class warfare. They are driven by "Greed is Go(o)d" but they are hman and they also depend on us. Now if THEY don't have enough cash for the project I work on, then I don't have a roof for my wife and kids. This is the reason why workers and industrialists are on the same side in this struggle: financial capitalism kills us all.

Bravo. Only one of you

Bravo. Only one of you actually understands that this "tax" is to be secured for UN purposes and to strip nations of their sovereignty. You better weigh the consequences of such folly. The best approach is to disband the Federal Reserve, jail those who have perpetrated this fraud (along with our politicians), tie our currency to silver and gold and allow the free market to revive this dying behemoth known as the "economy" (we know it as Fascism).

To Patrick of 18:41~ The

To Patrick of 18:41~ The "two" types you claim are hardly that. The second first: Goldman Sachs types do nothing but manipulate, gaming even their own to point of elimination, adding nothing of value, only widespead misery here and around the world. The first "you can live with" -millions of your fellow beings cannot . Uncounted millions are homeless, starving, dying, are being slaughtered while we "live" with it. Your "good" capitalists, corporations, produce nothing, paying their employees a small fraction of the value-added by the workers, the major amount goes to unearned personal wealth accumilation, buying priviledge and lawmakers, etc., which allows them to pollute, poison and destroy. All wealth is created exclusively by labor working with earth's resources. Refute that. You are really accepting BOTH under the capitalist regime, whose primary purpose is to gain and maintain supremacy of those who have the overwhelming wealth, allowing only enough of their usurpted wealth to sustain ever-fewer workers (not even having enough sense to understand they also need customers). Eliminating capitalism frees up this accumilated wealth to be administered by those who create it, with representative peoples government responsible only to labor, representing all humanity and living with full respect to the earth. Large industries that truely produce to peopls needs rather than profit can be governed by worker-boards, Small businesses continue to provide needed services. We can literally "have it all"... ~John L.

Ellen, What are your

Ellen, What are your thoughts on Geithner's input on this issue at the G-20? He came on a bit strong. It should be noted, another reason that GS made a large profit was because they had several rounds of layoffs to cut expenses and went from a fiscal to a calendar year when it became a "bank holding company". With all the bad press, there are many things behind the scenes that the general public does not know anything about. Namely, many decent; hardworking; talented people were collateral damage in the bloodbath process. Others have jumped ship to form their own start-up ventures or join smaller hedge funds for various reasons - mostly seeing the writing on the wall. You should read World Inc. by Bruce Piasecki: http://www.worldincbook.com/ In World Inc, Bruce provides his insight on how corporations have become more powerful than government. However, the reality is no organization is too big to fail. Like the Big Bang Theory - once things expand sufficiently there will be an eventual implosion. American citizens and our government collectively need to support small businesses (those who take calculated risks) to help our economy rebound from the financial crisis. There should have been a second bailout for CIT because the TARP money cannot be repaid due to the bankruptcy and CIT's viability is crucial to lending for small businesses. A jobless recovery is not in our best interest. More aggressive intervention needs to be taken by the administration to stimulate the job market. And, yes - The Tobin Tax should be considered. ~ Audra

Hi, Geithner said he wanted

Hi, Geithner said he wanted the banks to pay the money back after they got back on their feet rather than taking it out of a Tobin tax, but that assumes that the banks actually get back on their feet; and he's ignoring the harm high-speed program trading can do to the markets. Interesting that Gordon Brown now favors the tax though. Trying to redeem himself before election time perhaps.

Why not try the tax for a

Why not try the tax for a few years? See if it is manageable, if it adds anything to the bottom line of the US (to defray other expenses... like health care), if it slows the breakneck speed of our "roll the dice" banking giants? Why not try? Why not? Let's try something!

These are the structural

These are the structural components that are bleeding us dry: Capital Medicine Education Immigration/Colonialism Taxing one w/o taxing the rest is not just bias, but allows the sneaky bastards all kinds of outs. Medicine and Education can be considered components of Capital, and where Immigration/Colonialism is certainly the foundation of Capital -- it would collapse w/o out it. All those poor Latin-Americans surviving off the measly cocaine dollar !!

What ever happened to the

What ever happened to the idea of taxing excessive bonuses that was being floated by some members of Congress when they were first announcing the TARP plans. Let's go back to that. And raise the tax on Capital Gain. That is the fastest way to keep people out of the casino. Many economists claim the only cure for government debt is to raise taxes. Lowering taxes and interest rates has not worked so it stands to reason that raising taxes, starting with the wealthy and Capital gains, should be the next move. During the Nixon and Reagan administrations the wealthiest Americans paid far move than they do now. Those were popular Republican presidents. Let's return to those tax policies.

Let's slow down,

Let's slow down, people. Capitalism is not the stock market. Capitalism is the idea that every person has the right to determine where their money goes. We have centuries of data suggesting that capitalism provides the best life for the most people. I agree that the way our current stock market is rigged like a casino, but that's for a couple of reasons: 1) Governmental restrictions on trades and filing requirements mean that people can paper over huge flaws in the actual business. 2) Everyone thinks they ought to invest, but most people treat it like gambling instead of like an investment. This is a huge social issue, not an economic one. When investors treat stock like the long-term equity that it is, they make money. If you treat it like gambling, you don't. It takes 20 minutes reading and an hours worth of work to figure out if a stock is a good bet, but people assume that risk = completely incomprehensible instead of risk = knowable chance of __.

To John L.Opperman - First

To John L.Opperman - First sorry for the delay, I was not monitoring this page. I essentially agree with you, especially about wealth being generated by the combination of work and resources. Please note that I didn't call the industrial capitalists "good", I just pointed out that even though they indeed try to squeeze as much money from the workers as possible, they still need the workers and they do provide jobs. This is not the case with the Goldman Sachs and their ilk who couldn't care less not only about the workers but also the industrialists and their own breed. With this in mind, I find industrialists on the workers' side when it comes to shhoting down the banksters. The sooner the better so that we can resume our good old-fashioned class struggle with the industrialists and try to get some progress in the mix. Some will argue that finance is as necessary for industrial projects to succeed as work and resources; true enough but this hardly requires the existence of a second market (stock market) and certainly has nothing to do with the imposition of the Tobin tax. This would be a very good first step to harness finance so that it serves the public good instead of just a select few. Some... person suggested above that the fed should be disbanded and that the money should be reverted back to gold and silver - the content of the post is essentially useless, but one could very much make the case that the government should control its own money, and that the money it used to bail out the bank should give it control over said banks. This was avoided on the ground of big government fear; to me this is just silly: if I have to pay for them, at least I should own them through my government.

"Capitalism is not the stock

"Capitalism is not the stock market. Capitalism is the idea that every person has the right to determine where their money goes." -------------------No, Capitalism is the Roman system that we have inherited. What he is talking about is family capital, which is today the corporation, what socialism fights. Communism, in contrast, gives capital completely to the bureaucracy, which is structurally and neurologically the same as Capitalism, easily understood if you have worked in both.

"Goldman Sachs and their

"Goldman Sachs and their ilk.. ..couldn't care less not only about the workers but also the "industrialists and their own breed.. ..I find industrialists on the workers' side when it comes to shhoting down the banksters"-------------This is not neurologically supported. All controlling types are the same and interchangeable in that they easily stab others in the back. Forget class struggle, commie cruft. We need the original family-based community, the tribe, and regional autonomy, where people are directly and emotionally connected through empathic neurons, and those who cannot neurologically feel remorse are prevented from reproducing so that their genetic disorder can no longer spread. As is, the defectives are about 20%, and growing ever faster thanks to global capital.

I'm confused. Is everybody

I'm confused. Is everybody really dumb enough to not know that profits are taxed? The article says that gambling is taxed and trading is not - completely and utterly untrue - you don't pay a tax every time you bet, you pay taxes on net winnings, the same as banks do - in fact, short-term capital gains taxes are quite high.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.

This shows a hilarious lack

This shows a hilarious lack of knowledge about the financial sector. This kind of thinking is precisely the problem with the average person thinking they know about economics. I have some advise; leave throwing around economic policy to the people who, you know, went to school for it.

Companies also use the publicly traded (second hand market) to judge when it is best to issue new stock (raise funds). Regardless, companies raise most of their funds from bonds. "On average, the amount of new financing raised using bonds is ten times the amount raised using stocks. By contrast, countries such as France and Italy make more use of equities markets than of the bond market to raise capital" (frederic Mishkin) Saying they win because they have an algorithm is as crazy as saying I got a good grade on my money and banking exam because I had good programs on my calculator. Tools don't make the money.

This also completely ignores dividends.

Just FYI, our financial market is more regulated than Europe's. Which is why we lost a substantial share of the world market over seas. The economy would come crashing down without a vibrant financial sector. (does anyone remember the 60s and 70s?!)

Actually, all of this just confirms what everyone knows. Liberals, stay out of the economy and fight for civil rights. It is where we all appreciate your banter.